SayMore

Corbin Page

@corbin.eth

Unpopular opinion: Airdrop hunters, both humans _and_ bots 🤖, are the most important scaleable user base in crypto rn. Quests, contests, streaks, and giveaways work! These are super important crypto primitives. Folks that embrace this market will prosper during the 🐻.

Emre Ekinci

@ekinci.eth

How are bots positive? @saymore

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Dan Romero

@dwr.eth

Depends what you're building. Any sophisticated investor will model our what the LTV of your avg. user is. If user is only there to get paid, then the users aren't worth anything.

Michael Paler

@mhpaler

“Important” for what? Not for real utility. And my favorite web3 essayist agrees!

SpaceBucks

@sjm.eth

Not even worth coming on and kicking the tires? Offering liquidity, making trades, etc.

Dan Romero

@dwr.eth

Sure but that’s just QA

Corbin Page

@corbin.eth

Bots pay gas and protocol fees which translate to project kpis

Jacob

@jrf

*Most important* though? Or just at certain phases? I can see this deceiving a founding team with illusory PMF

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

what if the utility is “Speculation as a Service” what if you could now finally separate speculation from initial/early distribution when I squint and turn my head sideways - feels like advertising

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

retention, retention, retention

Michael Paler

@mhpaler

But speculation as a service isn’t what most web3 companies are selling even though they are using airdrops to generate interest. What feels like advertising?

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

agree, not what most web3 companies are selling but what it is becoming literally, airdrop farming as service advertisers will go where there the masses are paying attention not surprising this is coming from a media based org

accountless.eth

@accountless.eth

Corbin are you farming on farcaster? how often do you use it even though it’s not giving you a token?

accountless.eth

@accountless.eth

Project KPI’s are fake. If you have a leaky bucket that’s just a bunch of turning farmers.

accountless.eth

@accountless.eth

@corbin.eth meet austin. he works at spindl. if you wanna nerd out, tell him some of the things you are thinking through. he can talk to you ab ROI for these sweepstakes w farmers and retention (none). @austincain meet corbin. super close pal of mine. he could use your advice. maybe he will direct cast u? 👀

Liang良😬q/dau

@liang

And in more and more cases, airdrop farmers are being taken advantages of, paying more gas than the airdrop that may or may not happen

Justin Hunter

@polluterofminds

Hard disagree. Airdrop farmers don’t spend money.

Meg

@catjam

Big agree. I’m skeptical of airdrop farming as a long term mechanism — these users are essentially valueless

Meg

@catjam

Curious what makes you think they’re working! Haven’t been impressed by the quest type tools tbh

Liang良😬q/dau

@liang

they spend gas tho

Justin Hunter

@polluterofminds

That’s not something that benefits me as an app developer.

Liang良😬q/dau

@liang

yes thats very true. much easier to make a case if you are selling block space(chains)

Dewi Yuliana

@overcute.eth

Maybe yes, but I think if there are too many, it could be a double-edged sword, we can see from sei, which they consider "community is key" But ended up with a lot of fudders 😅

tjark

@tjark

If done really well and includes actually rewarding (real) users, this could be nice. Don't think this has been executed in ways that really benefited users, with very few examples. Most of the time this strat extracts value from those that don't know better and often captures users from low income conditions (+ bots)

tjark

@tjark

One of the reasons why we're discussing this here is because Twitter is unusable due to the sheer amount of fake-airdrop scams. This is a narrative we've created and it's dangerous. How do we foster a safer environment around it and align incentives again?

tjark

@tjark

Let's look at a quest for example: Best case the value should be in a user actually learning about a protocol/product they use. In reality the quest is just purchasing transactions/volume. If done via Questing protocol you usually only earn their userbase for the amount of time the quest is live

tjark

@tjark

Feels mega hard to get people's brains to actually process what they doing when they hunt an incentive you put on top of the "real incentive". The real incentive (&highlight) here would be "actually using a great product". Quests often put an additional (often imaginary, like XP or NFT) at the end of the process.

tjark

@tjark

Drifted far off here, but I want to end it with agreeing! I do believe quests, contests, streaks, & giveaways are awesome! But as a tool to honestful engage & reward an audience/community - just not as a growth hack. Campaigns like that need a lot more work & resources than most of them currently receive IMO

tjark

@tjark

Thanks for teasing my brain @corbin.eth :)

yehoshzl

@yehoshzl

This is the first “unpopular opinion” I’ve seen that is indeed unpopular.

Lawson.fm

@lwsnbaker

The irony that Proof of Work is what started all of this. Bitcoin miners knew they’d get paid and users knew they’d pay transaction fees from day one. Airdrop farmers are no different. They perform a service and should get paid. The real question is does the service add value to users who will pay to transact?

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

proof of work analogy highlights where value accrues which brings in to question where value accrues with airdrop farming

Lawson.fm

@lwsnbaker

it’s a leaky bucket if if it’s a one time event. worse when the other side of market doesn’t want to pay for the service or doesn’t exist.

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

this is why retention matters

Michael Paler

@mhpaler

I must say the concept of airdrop farming being analogous to proof of work is intriguing. However, after giving it a good think, I have to conclude it’s a stretch. Mining directly supports the network; airdrop farming is meant for building a network of eyeballs and only incidentally supports the network.

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

it is a HUGE stretch - I am questioning airdrop farming and where value accrues!

Lawson.fm

@lwsnbaker

It’s a function of time horizon and repeatability. The one and done Airdrops are likely a thing of the past. In the future earning mechanics will be treated like products seeking market fit (retention*). *However, retention isn’t free. You must pay (airdrop) or add social value (gamification).

Lawson.fm

@lwsnbaker

Where work is fungible (easily programmable), then comp must be primarily money/tokens. Where work is more non-fungible (social), gamification and social status will be the primary driver but money is still required as well for long term viability unless you want a revolt (see Web2 social).

jamesyoung.eth

@jamesyoung

smart - need continued bear market cover to give us time to figure this out!

Liang良😬q/dau

@liang

Also can we also say the same about speculators?

Liang良😬q/dau

@liang

speculators made coinbase and friend tech

Corbin Page

@corbin.eth

Ya, they are a super important user segment. 👍

Michael Paler

@mhpaler

Alternative take. Maybe airdrop hunting, for want of a better phrase, “paid, crowdsourced bug hunting”?
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