Cameron Armstrong
@cameron
The generation of men who’s value structure and worldview was fully trained their entire lives by society for a planet that doesn’t exist anymore.
It’s not an excuse for behaviors, but it’s absolutely a logical reason for a huge chunk of now demonized behaviors in guys.
Also…
Mike
@mc
“The generation of men who’s value structure and worldview was fully trained their entire lives by society for a planet that doesn’t exist anymore.”
@saymore
I need to find a time to chat with you IRL
Author Reply ❌
Farcaster Comments
ted (not lasso)
@ted
⭐ Threadstarter
finally an optimistic yet moving piece on the male loneliness epidemic, which imo has largely been ignored.
worthwhile (long) read about this dude ranch retreat that combines the cowboy lifestyle with empathy training for men to learn applied emotional intelligence.
thoughts?
gq.com/story/confident-man-ranch-profile
ted (not lasso)
@ted
would post this in farcastHIM for ~*the men*~
marvelgirl.eth
@marvel-girl
At first I was like do we need more boi confidence? but damn loving how this focuses on empathy training. Huge unlock
timdaub 🥝/🫦
@timdaub.eth
7mins into this I can confidently say that to respond, more characters than 300 would be necessary for a proper discussion
timdaub 🥝/🫦
@timdaub.eth
btw I think this is the type of article where there‘s an issue between
- published opinion: what you can write online
- public opinion: what you can say only offline and with friends
This article is definitely „published opinion“ so far. A lot of arguments could be cleared through personal anecdotes
ted (not lasso)
@ted
wanna talk about it on @unlonely some time? i would love to learn from your perspective, also given that we are different genders so it is your lived experience vs. my observed experience
ted (not lasso)
@ted
cc would love honest opinions and reactions from @cameron, @hyper, @farcasteradmin.eth, @july and @nonlinear.eth — men i admire for their honesty and thoughtfulness (and, often, cheekiness).
ChatGPT summary below since it is a long article.
tldr (tim reilly)
@tldr
The theme reminds me tangentially of a great episode of Fleabag (Season 1, Episode 4).
Phoebe is at an all-women silent retreat. It is happening on the same property as an all-men "A Better Man" retreat, where they are learning how to communicate with women in a less bitter way (through practice with a woman doll)
chris
@ckurdziel.eth
I think this tracks - will read the article too. seeing similar stories in mid-life for friends. many of whom have hit a lot of the conventional metrics of "success" but maybe need work in other places
definitely need a positive modern def of "manliness" in the fallout of the discourse around "toxic masculinity"
tldr (tim reilly)
@tldr
I would watch
Michael Williams
@michael
Good concept but I can't help but think The Confident Man Ranch Retreat is a huge branding fail
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
toxic masculinity must go
any effort to make it go faster is justified and for the better
Jeff Feiwell
@hyper
Literally the opposite. This is a stupid label that tries to group the worst 1% with the rest
This term only contributes to the epidemic. Men only have purpose when they’re responsible for something which requires many of the traits listed under “toxic masculinity”. For example controlled aggression is GOOD
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
☝️ muted, I'm glad scum that advocates for aggression in 21st century is so easy to identify
timdaub 🥝/🫦
@timdaub.eth
mhhh I don‘t know, I‘ll think about it
Nico.cast
@n
is this... the Mojo Dojo Casa House?
Belfort
@belfort
I think I need a visit to the confident man ranch
Jacob
@jrf
Whatever works to help us evolve
For me, these things can feel forced, but even completely arbitrary contexts can be fun & rewarding where there's quality time for connection & reflection
Mark
@markfishman
I imagine “controlled aggression” could be described with a different word that you would endorse
Strength?
Passion?
Would rather you two find common ground than just mute
Jeff Feiwell
@hyper
Lol his choice. If you’re a mom and your kids are getting harassed are you sitting there saying “wow I wish my husband wasn’t capable of violence”
Or if you’re a female employee of a company in a hyper competitive market are you wishing your male colleagues were not aggressive?
It’s a stupid label
eunika🍒
@eunika
Got my follow for that one ser 🫡
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
none of this is what anyone would ever mean by "aggression"
they know exactly what they've meant
there is no reason to find common ground with such people, as there is no way to change their minds
aggressors must be isolated and forgotten by society, as the law always states
Cameron Armstrong
@cameron
Honestly teared up at some parts.
In a way it’s “You’re Kenough” branded so it can actually break through to men that would never watch the Barbie movie.
The confident man shtick probably feels cringe to online + younger people, but I think it’s unironic modernist presentation is perfect for…
Jacob
@jrf
Men, let's settle this the old fashioned way
Cameron Armstrong
@cameron
This slaps
“Expecting men to be emotionally intelligent in their relationships,” she writes, “is like expecting people to know how to do a butterfly backstroke when they’ve been instructed to never get wet.”
It’s exactly how I’d describe the challenge most men from my upbringing and military service
Cameron Armstrong
@cameron
Down to do a co-stream about this something for sure 🫡
Thanks for sharing
Jeff Feiwell
@hyper
I’ll be in Weehawken at high noon tomorrow
Bias 🫧 b/ias
@bias
Everyone has an aggressive drive, it’s more about whether you are aware or educated about this fact and can recognize when your own aggression drive has commandeered most of your attention and character structure
Sam
@samantha
Would also love your thoughts on this @matthew as you mentioned a bit of this stuff on the stream with @ishika :)
Matt Lee
@mattlee
That’s what the main channel is
James
@jamesstevens
I think this is your vegan diet acting out
James
@jamesstevens
pls define toxic. regards, my hypothalamus
Michael Pfister
@pfista
Muting is a form of controlled aggression
matthias
@iammatthias
Sabers at dawn?
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
☝️ muted too, i do not appreciate toxicity or ridiculing if people's choices
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
it is the opposite: the decision to walk away from the conflict
James
@jamesstevens
your micro aggressions are putting cracks in your glass house
derek
@derekbrown.eth
We need to reclaim the definition of healthy men as "warrior poets": men who create culture and love others well...but are also willing and able to fight for the culture they've created.
From the Fianna, a Gaelic tradition which trained young men in the art war...and poetry.
Cameron Armstrong
@cameron
Short version is that while the outcomes of the old (and in many places still current) world order benefitted men systemically, men were still also shaped, abused, and stunted by that system.
The system is/already changed, but the scars are still there and there’s no guidebook to figure out what’s next for guys
Cameron Armstrong
@cameron
hmu on telegram, my man 🫡
T.me/camarmstr
BC
@bc-zip.eth
"confident man ranch" sounds more an SNL skit with phil hartman in it tbh
jamesyoung.eth
@jamesyoung
hot take
as a minority born in the US on the other side of 50, partnered to the same person for over half that time - this reads as a midlife crisis (I may be just projecting)
wasn’t this the unspoken trade off of privilege - now marketed as toxic masculinity
hard to see past the cis white male gaze
Jack Miller
@cosimojack.eth
Damn, dude. I feel like I typically agree with you (to an odd degree), but have to say you came at that guy HARD for what read (to me) like a rather benign difference of opinion.
Benefit of the doubt I think there’s a more charitable interpretation than the way you took it.
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
i gave up on benefit of the doubt a long time ago for people whom i don't know (or recognize) and who actively show that they are toxic from the first moments of interaction
time is limited and i'd rather spend it with people who are not toxic or aggressive
bit.ly/3LLl0rZ
borodutch 👈👈😎👖💨
@farcasteradmin.eth
for instance, notice how you here disagree with my opinion completely — and i actively try to explain my opinion to you, instead of dismissing you like i did with the person advocating for aggression above
this is because you haven't shown toxic attitude in your message, and i'm thankful for that
Jack Miller
@cosimojack.eth
Here I go agreeing with you again
I’m also quick to block / mute for the exact same reason - toxicity.
Ppl can be so much more toxic and mean online than they’d ever be in person.
And I agree being overzealous is worth the risk of false positives.
Just saying you went nuclear on that guy with your reply lol